Napetost v Ukrajini - Krimu

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
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V članku je nekaj špekulacije, da motijo mafijo, ki deluje v tistih koncih, v glavnem pa gre za neposlušnost ob ukazih iz Moskve. Najlažja in najučinkovitejša rešitev je likvidacija.
 

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
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V sirski temi je bila debata, zakaj ne bežijo pred ATGM.


Nič ni slišat in eno malenkost je videt. V prvo nisem opazil nič, dokler ni vžgalo.
 

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
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Meduza je objavila intervjuje s par ruskimi prostovoljci

https://meduza.io/en/feature/2016/02/19/you-could-say-we-proved-ourselves

Citat:
Alexander Nelyubin

Code name: “Cross,” from St. Petersburg

Before the war, I rented a small grocery store outside St. Petersburg with another guy. I ran a business there.

I went to the Donbas in July 2014—to defend our Russian world from attacks by the West, of course. It was necessary to meet the enemy at our borders. My blood began to boil after the events at the House of Trade Unions in Odessa.

...

I served in a reconnaissance and sabotage team, the “Kalmius” special detachment.

...

Then I was stationed elsewhere. I was together with several other soldiers. They said they were from the GRU [Russian Military Intelligence]. The commander of my reconnaissance team said he was from there, too.

There was support from Russia, certainly. First, it was from volunteers and patriotic organizations. Later, of course, a fair amount supplies began to come in. At first, weapons had to be seized. Then, brand new ones began to arrive, even still coated in [protective] grease.

In the DNR, there were very big problems in terms of organization and coordination. Many were killed due to stupidity and incompetence.

...

Those of us still alive—all wounded and shell-shocked—shot our way out from that cauldron. The same commander who'd ordered us “head-on” into battle wanted us executed for retreating. But afterwards, I was made the DNR's deputy defense minister.

Russia gave out funds to bury these children, for their families. Big money. But the kids were buried quickly, and the money was parcelled out. Everyone is still silent about this part of the war

...

Almost all my comrades left the field a while back. The killings of [Aleksei] Mozgovoy and other worthy commanders contributed to their decisions [to return]. Everyone knows who killed them—the authorities of the “People's Republic.” Because of money and disobeying orders. All the goods from those humanitarian convoys? The very next day they were being sold off in the markets. Aid and medicine from Russia were mercilessly plundered by Cossacks and other entities under the control of the republic's leaders.

...

After my service, it's been very difficult to get back into civilian life. My wife was worried about my state of mind. I'm not used to all the silence. I wake with a start during the nights. When I drink, I remember my comrades and the war rushes back. I've been taking corvalol [a mild tranquilizer].





Svetlana

Code name: “Karma,” from Solikamsk

Before I left for the war, I was a manager in publishing. In my spare time, I rock-climbed, did “sports tourism,” and mountaineering. In March 2014, I was awarded a “Mountaineer of Russia” badge, having passed all the training standards.

Starting July 2014, all the more often I saw news on TV about the events in the Donbas. All that was happening touched me to the depths of my soul—resurgent fascism, the genocide of the Russian population, attacks on civilian towns—I could not remain indifferent.

...

On December 1, 2014, I arrived in Donetsk and immediately fell in with the international brigade, which they called the “15” Brigade, and I still call them that now.

...

I continue my service to this day. They say there is a ceasefire now. In reality, there isn't. The shelling continues. Ukraine will not withdraw its troops from the border and at any moment they could go on the offensive. Yeah, I've gotten used to it all now. It's just hard simply to pick up and leave.

Most recently, many Russians are returning home. This is probably is due to the fact that active hostilities have ceased. The “militia” is gradually turning into a regular republican army. Only now, talk about “Putin surrendering the Donbas” is becoming more frequent.





Alexander Fomichenko

Code name: “Laplander,” from Murmansk

Before the journey to the Donbas, I served in the Army. I wore officers' epaulettes. Then I retired, and worked in the security business. Each year, I traveled to the hero-city of Odessa. I have relatives there. I generally liked Ukraine.

I was very affected by what happened at the House of Trade Unions. So I went in the summer of 2014, to help people.

...

When I finally reached the Donbas, I realized there is a big difference between what they show in the media and what is actually going on. Everything wasn't so rose-colored. I expected there to be military discipline—some kind of training. But there was not. And the media made everything look so colorful.

...

There were many cases when our unit (in those times, Igor Plotnitsky was both Head of the Lugansk People's Republic and of the Defense Ministry) was sent on the offensive without any kind of proper weapons. But I was luck. We wound up with a good commander, a Cossack hetman, and he protected us and did not treat our lives carelessly. For this, he was even arrested a couple of times.

...

Local ranking commanders did as they saw fit. I saw this little squirt of a 22-year-old, a boy really, who they gave the rank of major. It was because his mother was a business woman. I guess it didn't really matter.

In one case, two of my comrades were killed by the glorious [separatist] Dawn Battalion, which is made up of locals. They were drunk and shot at our car. Maybe they were already blackout drunk and delirious—I don't know.

...

For many of the people I know, life has changed greatly. After what they've seen there, some people turn to heavy drinking. For some, their shot nerves exacerbated other diseases. Some are already dead.

“New Russia” was a good idea, all the same. But it somehow didn't come to be. When I arrived there, we were all waiting to go farther and farther west. But the head of the republic told us to stop.

After all of this, my views on life have changed. I value life more. I have no regrets. I can say I proved myself. For centuries Russia has been at war, right?





Daria

Code name: “Phoenix,” from Moscow

I joined the ranks of the militia in early December 2014. Before that, I was working at a real estate firm. It was just a job to earn money. My labor of love is tattoos; it's long been my hobby.

From the very beginning of this whole mess in Ukraine, I anxiously watched the situation get worse and worse. I had no idea it would turn out like this. When the fighting broke out, I couldn't just sit on the sidelines. Slavs killing Slavs—how could it be!?

...

I received a blessing from the spiritual father [at my church] and went [to eastern Ukraine]. Such a decision cannot be made at random. The deciding factor was direction from above.

I got my things together, I made some inquiries, and decided I had to join the “Phantom” Brigade, under [commander Alexei] Mozgovoi. Those in the know said that he protects you. As it turned out, they were right.

...

When we passed through Debaltseve, the situation there even made some experienced men lose their heads. I just looked on. Someone frowned and said, “You're inhuman if this doesn't get to you.” That's totally not the case. I simply turned my emotions off. I had to.

About the current situation in the ranks of the Donbas militia, I won't say anything. Everything is very complicated, and only those in the know can understand it. The mood there now is mixed. Yes, [Moscow] is giving up the Donbas. It's so obvious now that it's almost boring to say.

Ruska TV, sploh s poročanjem o Odesi, je bila odlično sredstvo za rekrutacijo kanonfutra.
 

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
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Kharkiv, februar/marec 2014, pred krimskim referendumom

https://www.facebook.com/alexandr.yanovsky.7/videos/608691025875012/

"Antifašistična" bagra.

V bistvu gre za uvod v ta, v temi že nalepljen video


http://euromaidanpress.com/2014/03/01/storming-the-regional-state-administration-in-kharkiv-march-1/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_2014_pro-Russian_unrest_in_Ukraine#March

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There were reports of busloads of Russian citizens crossing the border into Ukraine to support pro-Russian demonstrators.[6][7] At an administrative building in Kharkiv, a Russian from Moscow replaced the Ukrainian flag with a Russian one.[6] Demonstrators supporting Russia vandalized the parliament building and beat civilians, but Reuters reported that this had alienated many local ethnic Russians, who were speaking and mobilizing in support of the Ukrainian government.[8][9] The flag was restored and 200 policemen guarded the building.[8]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/04/world/europe/russias-hand-can-be-seen-in-the-protests.html

Citat:
As pro-Russia demonstrations in 11 cities have suddenly erupted where significant populations of ethnic Russians live, the apparent organization of the demonstrators, appearances of Russian citizens and reports of busloads of activists arriving from Russia itself suggest a high degree of coordination with Moscow. At a minimum, Russians are instigating protests by Ukrainians sympathetic to Moscow, helping to create a pretext for a broader intervention if Mr. Putin decides to push things that far.

...

Amid the rumors and rising anxiety, self-declared municipal self-defense groups have emerged, saying they are ready to fight the spread of fascism — Mr. Putin’s description of the new leadership and its supporters — from the country’s west with Russia’s help.

Monday’s seizure of the government building here was led by Pavel Gubarev, the founder of the People’s Militia of Donbass, the coal-mining region where Donetsk is. In a speech from the dais of the captured chamber, he rejected Kiev’s authority and called on Mr. Putin to bring troops to the city.

Ha ha, Gubarev.

 
Nazadnje urejeno:

Kamele0N

YUGOslovanski mehanik Dmitri Mendeleev
23. jul 2008
42.262
5.646
113
To kar smo nekateri ze ves cas govoril...

...cista kopija srbske balvan revolucije na balkanu v 90's

Ko zmanjka denarja/interesa pa cudezen razpad fronte na celi dolzini...

Upam da putka nakonc se bankrotira...in da ni to samo zacasno zaradi Sirije
 

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
2.211
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Na Krimu že lovijo nov kanonfuter, direktno iz porodnišnice.

http://must.rk.gov.ru/rus/index.htm/news/330220.htm

Citat:


registrar Ministertsva Department of Justice of the Republic of Crimea held solemn ceremonies of registering the birth of boys "Russia's glorious sons", timed to the Day of Defender of the Fatherland.

In the Simferopol district registry office solemnly registered the birth of three boys. P he first state document, birth certificate, young residents of Simferopol district handed Colonel Sergei Glusker. The representative of the department of the military commissariat of the Republic of Crimea in Simferopol district presented the future defenders of the Fatherland "Agenda 24 January 2032".

...

Representatives of the departments of the military commissariat of the Republic of Crimea and the combat veterans participating in the event, warmly and sincerely congratulate the young mothers and fathers on the birth of sons and wished to honor bear the high and the proud title of "parents", to raise their boys worthy citizens of our country, the real patriots of the Motherland educate them in love of work and respect for elders.

Parents of newborns Fatherland Defenders were awarded flowers, souvenirs and brochures "10 Commandments for Parents" by the Department of Civil Registry Office of the Ministry of Justice of the Republic of Crimea, as well as cards with values ​​of names of long-awaited son.

tole

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as well as cards with values of names of long-awaited son

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a takzhe otkrytki so znacheniyami imen dolgozhdannykh synovey

So delili vojaške knjižice?
 

ceedevita

Majstr
24. jul 2009
6.901
114
63
štajerska
https://www.rt.com/news/333801-ukraine-special-forces-crimea/

Kiev trains ‘special unit’ to take back Crimea from Russia – Ukrainian Interior Minister
---
In fact, the Ukrainian minister said that Kiev is presently training a special force, separate within the National Guard.

“We are training some guys with the help of Mustafa Dzhemilev and Refat Chubarov (Crimean Tatar activists in Ukraine),” he said, while giving no details, adding, “We are working on a project that will prepare us to regain Crimea.”
...
 

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
2.211
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https://twitter.com/loogunda/status/704305509642457088

CcYvHslW0AAs6Dp.jpg
 

Rosenthal

Pripravnik
11. okt 2007
515
18
18
Citat:
All of a sudden, straight out of nowhere, Ukraine creeps back into the news.

There is renewed fighting in the rebellious eastern regions. There is political warfare in Kiev. There is paralysis in the upper reaches. There is some new formation called the Revolutionary Right Forces occupying the Maidan—the very same Independence Square where, two years ago this past Sunday, months of protests tipped into violence and an elected president was ousted.

This is how we spooked Putin: What the New York Times won’t tell you about the American adventure in Ukraine

Citat:
Ukraine has gone from political crisis to armed conflict to humanitarian crisis with no break in the regress since the American-cultivated coup in February 2014. But for many months now we have had before us a textbook example of what I call the Power of Leaving Out.

The most daring attempt at “regime change” since righteous Clintonians invented this self-deceiving euphemism in the 1990s has come to six-figure casualties, mass deprivation, a divided nation and a wrecked economy. If you abide within the policy cliques or the corporate-owned media, it is best to go quiet as long as you can in the face of such eventualities.


Bravo USA. Preudarno unicujete zivljenja 45 miljonov ljudi.
zmaga.gif
 

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
2.211
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RUSIJA okupira Krim.

RUSIJA ta isti Krim spreminja v vojaško trdnjavo.

RUSIJA pobija Ukrajince v Donbasu.

RUSIJA je sestrelila MH17.

Ampak krive so ZDA. Pajade.
 

AndY1

Guru
Osebje foruma
18. sep 2007
22.099
4.095
113
Kdo je investiral 5 milijard dolarjev v destabilizacijo Ukrajine?



Kdo je postavljal novo vlado?

 
Nazadnje urejeno:

Pac_Man

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10. maj 2014
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Citat:
Kdo je investiral 5 milijard dolarjev v destabilizacijo Ukrajine?

Celih 9 minut se mi ne da poslušat, tako da povej, kam naj skočim. Sicer, milijontič:



Gre za kompletno pomoč Ukrajini od l. 1992.



Citat:
Kdo je postavljal novo vlado?

Pri klicu gre za to, kako lahko lobirajo za uveljavitev Janukovičevega kompromisnega predloga, da z opozicijo ustvari koalicijsko vlado in kaj lahko ZDA storijo, da bi šla stvar skozi.

BBC, 25. januar 2014:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-25896786

Citat:
Ukraine's President Viktor Yanukovych has offered the post of prime minister to opposition leader Arseniy Yatsenyuk.

He also offered former boxer Vitali Klitschko the position of deputy PM.

In response, the opposition leaders did not explicitly say whether they accepted the offer, but repeated their demands for new presidential elections.

The offer came after talks on Saturday with the opposition in a new effort to end the deadly unrest that has spread across the country.

Prepis, klic je "ušel" 4. februarja:

Citat:
Nuland: OK. He's now gotten both Serry and [UN Secretary General] Ban Ki-moon to agree that Serry could come in Monday or Tuesday. So that would be great, I think, to help glue this thing and to have the UN help glue it and, you know, f.uck the EU.

Pyatt: No, exactly. And I think we've got to do something to make it stick together because you can be pretty sure that if it does start to gain altitude, that the Russians will be working behind the scenes to try to torpedo it. And again the fact that this is out there right now, I'm still trying to figure out in my mind why Yanukovych (garbled) that. In the meantime there's a Party of Regions faction meeting going on right now and I'm sure there's a lively argument going on in that group at this point. But anyway we could land jelly side up on this one if we move fast. So let me work on Klitschko and if you can just keep... we want to try to get somebody with an international personality to come out here and help to midwife this thing. The other issue is some kind of outreach to Yanukovych but we probably regroup on that tomorrow as we see how things start to fall into place.

Poglej rdeč del, v klicu so slabi fantje Rusi. Okrog kletvice so pa tri možnosti:

1) "F.uck the EU", (zaenkrat) pustimo ta cilj ob strani, važno da je mir

2) "F.uck the EU", EU se ne strinja s predlogom

3) "F.uck the EU", EU se po stari navadi ne more dogovorit in se vleče kot megla.

Šlo je za privaten klic, tako da malo bolj oster jezik ni nič nenavadnega.



Citat:
Imaš kakšen kredibilen vir za te trditve razen Bellingcat-a, ki je niko i ništa?

Imam. Nizozemsko policijo. Sicer gre za "eno od verzij, ki jo preiskujejo", ampak je edina oprijemljiva stvar, ki so jo zaenkrat dali iz rok. Verjetno samo pravni blabla.

Preskoči na 2:30. Buk je prišel iz Rusije, s posadko


Video je bil 30. marca 2015 objavljen na uradnem youtube kanalu nizozemske policije

https://www.youtube.com/user/politie/videos
 

AndY1

Guru
Osebje foruma
18. sep 2007
22.099
4.095
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Citat:
Uporabnik Pac_Man pravi:
Imam. Nizozemsko policijo. Sicer gre za "eno od verzij, ki jo preiskujejo", ampak je edina oprijemljiva stvar, ki so jo zaenkrat dali iz rok. Verjetno samo pravni blabla.

Torej spet nič uradnega in zaključenega. Eno od verzij ti prodajaš kot resnico.

Ampak, po tvoje je itak za vse vedno kriva Rusija, tako da nič novega.
 

Pac_Man

⋆Распут&
10. maj 2014
2.211
0
36
Objavljeno je na youtube kanalu nizozemske policije. BMHO je to dovolj uradno. Nezaključeno? Morda, ampak na začetku poletja se boš verjetno počutil precej neumno.

Kaj morem, če ves znan material kaže, da je MH17 sestrelila Rusija.
 

AndY1

Guru
Osebje foruma
18. sep 2007
22.099
4.095
113
Zakaj bi se počutil neumno? Vedno sem trdil, da je potrebno počakati na zaključek preiskave.

Ti pa zaključek preskakuješ in trdiš svojo verzijo.